Have any questions? Call us: 
Article:
New Zealanders Join Australian Cruise Ship Class Action
An Australian law firm is preparing a class action against major cruise lines on behalf of thousands of passengers – including New Zealanders – over lax onboard gambling rules.
The firm, Carter Capner Law, argues that vulnerable passengers are not adequately protected within cruise ship casinos and have been allowed to rack up thousands of dollars in debt.
The action is being taken against Carnival (which operates P&O) and Royal Caribbean.
Director Peter Carter says passengers are offered open lines of credit and, in some cases, have been unlawfully detained at the end of the journey if they cannot immediately settle their debts.
RNZ’s Kathryn Ryan spoke with Peter Carter and a passenger who has joined the class action, sharing their experiences of financial and emotional strain due to the alleged practices.
Full audio Transcript:
Speaker 1 (00:00):
An Australian law firm is preparing a class action against major cruise lines on behalf of thousands of passengers, including New Zealanders, over lax onboard gambling rules. The firm, Carter Capner Law, says vulnerable passengers are not protected within ship casinos and are able to rack up thousands of dollars worth of debt. The class action is being pursued against Carnival, which includes P&O, and Royal Caribbean cruise lines. Carter Capner Law director Peter Carter says passengers are allowed to open lines of credit, with some passengers even being unlawfully detained at the end of the journey if they can’t afford to settle the debt. We’ll speak to Peter Carter shortly, but first we hear from a cruise ship passenger who is joining the class action. We’ve agreed to keep their name anonymous for privacy reasons, but they’re with us now. Good morning and thanks for making time.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Good morning, Kathryn. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Could you tell us please about your experience?
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yeah, of course. So I’ve been an avid cruiser for most of my life. When I first started cruising in, I think it was 2013, I got on the boat and, you know, the casino lights and everything like that are just very enticing. Especially coming from Australia, we have a big gambling culture, so I was very enticed by the casino. Little did I know that I was able to rack up around $4,000 to $5,000 worth of debt, despite not having that money available on my card. Because when you go on a cruise, you have a cruise card and you can transfer from your cruise card to your casino account, and they don’t debit your bank account straight away. So you can rack up this money, which is essentially a line of credit to gamble with.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
So explain to me the cruise card and the casino account. How do transactions happen when you are on a cruise?
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Of course. So you have your cruise account, your normal cabin account, and then when you want to play at the casino, you transfer money from your cabin account, which is hooked up to a debit card. You are able to transfer that money from your cabin account to your casino account to be able to gamble. But the transfers from your debit card to your cabin account aren’t instantaneous from your bank. They only settle once or twice a day, I believe. That means you don’t need to have the money on your debit card to gamble.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Can you tell me about the Players Club that’s on one of these cruise lines at least?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Of course. So the P&O Players Club means that if you gamble a fair bit in the casino, you get incentives. These incentives include free drinks, free dinners, and free cruises. This year alone, I’ve been offered six free cruises – one was a 14-night overseas cruise completely paid for. While I’ve been on board, I’ve been given free drinks and free dinners. So my only real expense on board was playing at the casino. Everything else was pretty much fully paid.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Could you give us a situation where this got out of control for you? I think you’ve mentioned you were quite young when you went on your first cruise.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Oh, of course. So the first one I was 21, I believe. I had a bit of an underlying gambling problem, and it spun really badly out of control. At 21, I didn’t have too much money and I ended up racking up a final bill of about $4,600. Because I wasn’t aware that you could rack up this money, the debt had to be paid by my mum who was on board at the time. I was told that if the debt wasn’t settled, I wouldn’t be able to disembark. Even though it was settled, they didn’t put any preventions in place. I could still overdraw my casino account afterwards, even though they knew I couldn’t pay.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
At any point, was there any check on how much you were gambling? Did anyone ask questions?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
No, not on any cruise I’ve ever been on. The most recent one I went on was in October. This was a fully paid cruise, and I was aware I was going to gamble. I set myself a limit of about $2,000, but I ended up spending $8,000. My total turnover for that cruise was about $28,000.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
It was a “free cruise” with free food and free drinks, but you turned over $28,000?
Speaker 2 (05:23):
That’s correct.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
You turned over $28,000 in the casino?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
That’s correct. I confirmed this by asking the casino host before I disembarked. My biggest motivation for speaking out is to raise awareness. I understand what’s going on as part of the Players Club, but imagine a family of four with a parent who has an underlying gambling problem. They might think they’re just on a normal family holiday but end up a few thousand dollars in debt, unable to get off the boat. It ruins the whole experience. This needs to be more transparent or changed.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Tell me about the role of casino host.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Casino hosts, you know, I think it’s the classic American term. They’re there to make sure you are happy, you are gambling, you are spending all the money you need to, you’ve got everything you need – your food, your drinks, everything like that. They’re just there to make sure that you are comfortable, gambling, and not really bothered by anything else.
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Is anyone telling you what your tally is as time goes by? Do you even know how much your debt is at any given moment?
Speaker 2 (07:08):
No, not at all. You can see transfers on your onboard spending account between your cabin account and your casino account, but no one taps you on the shoulder and says, “Hey, maybe this is too much.” $28,000 is a lot of money and I was shocked. I’m known to be a bigger spender when I get on board, but $28,000 still blew me away. The only contact from the casino host was to give me my free drinks card – and that happened within the first day of the cruise because they want to encourage you to keep spending.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Alcoholic drinks as well?
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
You said your turnover on the latest cruise was $28,000. Did you say your actual loss was $8,000?
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yes. My loss from my bank account was $8,000 – that’s what I actually spent.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
And over the years you’ve been going on cruises and gambling since 21, how much do you think you’ve lost?
Speaker 2 (08:26):
It hasn’t been every year. The P&O Players Club is fairly new, only since about 2020 after COVID. Before that it was called something else. Overall, I’d say about $30,000 from my bank account, probably $40,000 total in the casino. That’s just a rough estimate.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Are there any credit checks done at any point?
Speaker 2 (09:03):
No. None at all.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Any limits on lines of credit?
Speaker 2 (09:10):
I believe the limit is around $5,000 before they ask how you’re going to pay or your account declines. That’s when they step in.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
That first cruise when you ran up $4,600 and your mum paid, what did they say when they came to collect?
Speaker 2 (09:43):
I was basically told, “You owe us this money. How do you expect to settle?” That was it. The baffling part was that once it was paid, I was still allowed to continue gambling. No checks or safeguards, even though they knew I couldn’t pay.
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Thank you for sharing that. That was a passenger involved in this move towards class action. Peter Carter is with us now, director of Carter Capner Law. Good morning.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Good morning, Kathryn.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Could you clarify what stage this proposed class action is at?
Speaker 3 (10:43):
We’re well advanced and expect to file either in December or January.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
How many people are likely to be signed up?
Speaker 3 (10:57):
The class will include everyone affected whether they register or not. We expect about 10,000 people, but the actual size won’t be known until the cruise lines disclose their passenger records.
Speaker 1 (11:28):
So basically everyone who had unchecked lines of credit or lost money at the casino is included?
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Correct. Anyone given lines of credit who had a net debt at the casino on any cruise. Many have already expressed interest, but legally everyone is included unless they opt out.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
You’ve had approaches from New Zealanders too?
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Yes. Around 7–10% of those contacting us are New Zealanders, the rest mainly Australians.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
What triggered you to start investigating this as a class action?
Speaker 3 (12:53):
It was after the death of a man in May this year. He had been gambling in a Carnival casino, lost money, and then went overboard. The response from the cruise line made it seem like anything goes on the high seas. But that’s not true – they are still bound by restraints and laws.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
In New Zealand, we regulate casinos tightly. Is it similar in Australia?
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Yes. Absolutely. Those rules don’t directly apply on the high seas. The law that applies is the law of the flag state – the country where the ship is registered. That could be Bermuda, the Bahamas, Panama, the UK. And even in those places, there are now consumer protection laws. Ships should at least observe those.
Speaker 1 (15:20):
So what about when the ship is in international waters?
Speaker 3 (15:32):
It doesn’t matter. The same issue applies anywhere in international waters.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
In New Zealand, the Gambling Act forbids providing credit if it’s intended for gambling. Is that one of the issues here?
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Yes. That’s a major issue. The class is defined around passengers provided with credit for gambling.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
So essentially people should be paying cash, or not gambling at all?
Speaker 3 (16:30):
That’s the intent of the rules in New Zealand and Australia, yes.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
What about rules around intoxication and incentives?
Speaker 3 (16:53):
There are rules forbidding allowing intoxicated people to gamble. There are also rules about offering incentives. Those are all tangentially relevant, but the primary issue is credit and incentives.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Have some passengers been effectively detained until they pay?
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Yes. Some were interrogated and told to settle debts before disembarking, even held for hours until arrangements were made. That is unlawful in Australia, and I presume in New Zealand as well.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Any extreme examples of losses?
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yes. One person lost $13,000, several others $5,000. This affects families, not just individuals. Often spouses don’t even know. That’s why we believe this conduct must be exposed.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
What outcome do you want?
Speaker 3 (19:13):
We want the practice of offering credit to stop. Since we announced our investigation, some changes have already started, but the credit issue must cease.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Thank you. We’ll keep in touch as things progress. That was Peter Carter of Carter Capner Law, preparing this class action against major cruise lines on behalf of thousands of passengers – both Australians and New Zealanders – who incurred casino debts. Carnival, P&O, and Royal Caribbean were approached for comment about credit availability, debt collection, and gambling protections onboard. No responses were received.